and the whales followed that trail out. killer whales get a bad rap. it's probably the name, but this is a pretty amazing and wonderful story. thanks so much for joining us. "piers morgan tonight" is next. tonight, another school, another shooting. where will it end? >> the shooter had numerous rounds of shotgun shells, 12-gauge shotgun. numerous rounds in his pocket. >> there was blood everywhere. >> now the clock is ticking. what will the white house do? >> even if what we do only saves one life, it makes sense. >> i'll talk to gabby giffords' husband, mark kelly, who is a gun owner and supporter of the second amendment. >> we elect some smart people who should be able to work out these issues. they have just neglected to do it. >> also, meet the man who says i'm off the rails when it comes to gun control, and we'll debate that theory. >> and the toll gun violence has taken on america. i'll ask tony robbins. you may be surprised to hear what he has to say. this is "piers morgan tonight."

good evening. vice president joe biden says his gun task force will have a set of recommendations on the president's desk by tuesday. that doesn't mean there's a consensus yet. listen to this from the nra after today's white house meeting. quote, we were disappointed with how little this had to do with keeping our children safe and how much it had to do with an agenda to attack the second amendment. we will not allow law-abiding gun owners to be blamed for the acts of madmen. i'm in favor of a nationwide ban on semiautomatic assault weapons and high volume magazines. i want to see president obama increasing federal funding for mental health treatment for all americans who need it. meanwhile, there's another school shooting today in california. a 16-year-old reportedly felt he

was being bullied was accused of attempted murder. the student took direct aim and hit one classmate in taft union high school. he then aimed specifically at another classmate and then missed. kyung lah is in california with the latest. every time you hear these stories right now, a shudder comes with it because of what happened at sandy hook. what do we actually know about what happened here? >> we're learning, actually, a little more. police officers just briefed us in the last hour or so. what they're telling us is that the 16-year-old shooter actually planned this, began the planning of it last night. he took the shotgun from his home, the home he's living it. it belongs to his brother, his 19-year-old brother, and the atf now tracking the registration. he then got the rounds. he went to bed, knew he was going to go in late. he went into his classroom,

directly to those two boys who he says he tells police, were bullying him, and he aimed at both of them, striking one of them. i want to show you now a picture of the teacher in that classroom because what stopped it? it was this man. this teacher, what he did in addition to the counselor at the school, they convinced the boy to put down the gun, and that, piers, is what ended all of this. >> do we thinke had a very specific set of targets or was he stopped from being more indiscriminate? >> very specific targets. at least that's what police say he told them. that he had two specific boys he was targeting today. what we're hearing from other parents and teachers is that they felt this boy had a troubled past. that they knew him from last year having a hit list, a boy who was bullied. he wrote down the list of popular kids in the school, primarily jocks who he didn't like. he had a hit list of kids he

wanted to kill, and that's what got him in trouble with the school last year. a lot of the parents telling me that they were surprised to hear when all of this was happening today that this boy was actually back in school. >> did they have any armed security at the school? >> this is a very interesting point. they normally do. a task police officer is normally assigned to this high school every single day, before, during, and after school. today, he couldn't make it here. we had very bad snow in the central california region. and so he couldn't get here. so there was no armed police guard. i did ask the police chief here, would it have made a difference if that armed police officer was on the campus premises like he normally is? and the police chief says it would have made no difference today. the entire police department, he says, was able to arrive within 60 seconds. they had an incredibly fast response time, and it was the words of the teacher, the words of the teacher that ended this.

and that's what they are saying, that it was absolutely vital that this teacher was able to be brave, able to distract this kid so the other kids could get away, and convince this boy to put down the weapon. >> he sounds a real hero. thank you very much, indeed. >> our next guest is a gun owner and supporter of the second amendment. mark kelly's wife, former congresswoman, gabrielle giffords was nearly killed in an appalling shooting in tucson two years ago. and mark kelly joins me now. welcome back. i always think of you and gabby and other victims of these shootings when there's a new shooting. and it flashes up on the screen. what goes through your mind? what did you think when you heard another school shooting today? >> well, you know, just like you, piers, i often think about what happened to gabby. what happened here a little over two years ago and how horrific an event that was. now i also think about what happened in newtown. we certainly can't allow ourselves to continue down this

road where this happens almost now on a regular -- as a regular occurrence. >> and the problem, it seems to me, you have the nra today coming out, utterly defiant as normal, really apart from potentially allowing some kind of debate about background checks, not interested in any discussion about gun control whatsoever. what is your reaction to that? >> you know, i was optimistic that after today's meeting in the white house, there would be some statement that they could find some common ground. you know, gabby and i like you said, we're gun owners, we're strong supporters of the second amendment. i think we're with the large part of american society that realizes there's a problem and realizes that we can come up with some common sense solutions to address this terrible condition we have in the united states. >> one of the bosses of the nra was on. listen to what he said to say.

>> we knew going into this meeting what the president's position on so-called assault weapon ban is, the same position he's taken for years. these are not new positions. the vice president had said we do this with an open mind, but at the meeting, he said, no, we have already made up our mind on that. no, there's not going to be an agreement on that. in a sense, they were checking a box, they were able to say we have met with the nra, we have met with the people who are strong second amendment supporters. that doesn't mean there isn't an area for agreement. >> the president of the nra. the point, mark, is it's just arrogance and it's dangerous arrogance. all the nra spokesmen i see out there, none of them want to entertain any form of gun restrictions whatsoever. they're not interested. doesn't matter how bad the scale of -- they go further. if you try to say they should, you're unpatriotic, un-american for attacking the second amendment.

>> i think gabby and i, i don't think you can get more american than the two of us. i served in combat, in desert storm, 39 missions over iraq and kuwait. gabby is a former member of congress from a western district, a gun owner who strongly supports the second amendment, but on issues like assault weapons and high capacity magazines and universal background checks, we differ with the nra, with the nra leadership. but in fact, i think a lot of, you know, our positions on this subject, are much in line with the nra membership. >> i think that's true. and i think a lot of people who are with the nra or affiliated with it feel uneasy with the intransigence coming after massacres like sandy hook. i want to play you a clip from my interview with alex jones. it's been watched by over 5 million people now, gone viral, and some people find it entertaining. i didn't. i found it terrifying. let's listen to what he had to say.

>> i'm here to tell you, 1776 will commence again if you try to take our firearms. doesn't matter how many lemmings you get on the street begging for them to have their guns taken. we will not relinquish them. do you understand? that's why you're going to fail and the establishment knows no matter how much propaganda, the republic will rise again when you attempt to take our guns. >> i mean, the thing that really concerned me about that, mark, was the scale of the vitriol, the alarming violence. putting aside the faintly ridiculous side to him, i found that very disturbing. he's got 50 guns, that guy, and he has a huge audience, 160 odd radio stations carry his show, the internet is full of him. and people believe that stuff. >> well, you know, i think i just lost some of my hearing in my right ear just listening to that. had to pull it out a little bit there. but you know, he's got a business and an audience, and i

think his audience expects that out of him. you know, he's certainly on one side. you know, one side of this issue. i don't think a lot of the country is with him, you know, with that. i thought, i have watched it several times, and it was very heated on his end. >> i also interviewed larry pratt last night from the gun owners. listen to what he had to say. >> your solution if you were there in that meeting would be to arm every school, every church, every hospital, everywhere that members of the public could be? >> you certainly would want to encourage people who are qualified to carry a concealed firearm to be able to do so in a school zone. right now, that is illegal. >> i mean, that's really what they want. almost all of the ones i talked to, more guns. they basically want to fill

every public place that has people in it, to have more guns around because it makes them safer. >> yeah, i don't agree with that, piers. i don't think by having more guns in the public you're going to be safer. i think and gabby does, you have the right to protect yourself in your home. to listen that the solution would be to put an armed guard in every school doesn't resonate well with me. i have flown airplanes in combat, i have been shot at on multiple occasions. it's chaos. i have friends who are former members of s.e.a.l. team six, and i asked their opinion about an armed guard at the front of a school with a man potentially walking in with an assault rifle and a high-capacity magazine, and they think it's a ridiculous idea. these things happen very fast. in that case, i don't think an armed security guard in the school would slow these guys down. then what do you do? do you put somebody in the

theater, a museum, a sports stadium. where does it end? >> if you go back to what happened to gabby on that day, there was somebody legally armed, a 24-year-old man, and he did actually in the end tackle jared loughner, but is that the answer? is that helpful in that situation? >> well, there was a man in a walgreens next to the safeway thatame out when he heard the shooting, pulled out his firearm, and nearly shot the man who was involved in taking down the gunman. so that was almost a horrific massacre followed by a horrific accident. it didn't happen. you know, in the case of mr. loughner, he had a magazine that had 32 rounds. i think he had another in the chamber, and he unloaded all those in a matter of seconds. i think it was about 15 seconds. if he had a ten-round magazine and could have been potentially, may not have happened, but if he

was taken down after unloading ten rounds in a magazine, then there would certainly be other people that didn't -- that died that day that would be alive today. and one of them would have been christina taylor green, a 9-year-old girl who was born on 9/11 and didn't live to see her tenth birthday. she was killed with a shot after the tenth round. >> the nra president went on to say that when asked for any kind of reason why he wouldn't want to ban ar-15s, for example, he cited his daughter, who is in the military and is the nearest thing to a military rifle in civilian terms, the ar-15, and she likes to use it on ranges and so on. what do you think of people in that position? >> well, certainly, there are a lot of options. for people who like to target shoot or hunt, there are other options other than assault weapons. you know, piers, i went hunting over thanksgiving with a friend of mine on his ranch in texas. the magazine in this case held six rounds.

i needed two. i put two rounds in the magazine, not even six. to have a high capacity magazine or an assault rifle, these things are really made to kill a lot of people very quickly. they're made for the military. i think general mcchrystal said it best, that he doesn't want his own kids around guns like this. he wants his soldiers to have weapons like this. >> the very specific campaign we have run on this show is similar now to what we're hearing from the president and joe biden, and it is as you feel and gabby feels towards these assault weapons, yet there is this extreme resistance already from the nra just talking about that. what is your message to the nra? >> well, you know, i would like to be able to sit down with the nra at some point and talk to them about this. i know members, i know a lot of members of the nra, i thought about joining the nra at one point. i think the nra does a lot of great things. most nra members are very responsible gun owners.

i would like to talk to them about what does their membership feel, and maybe we could come to some common sense solutions on some of these problems. we're not going to agree on everything, but this is just happening way too frequently. and we can't have another 20 first graders murdered in their classrooms in this country. it's just enough. >> i mean, the most dispiriting thing to me, and i totally concur with you, i'm sure many nra members are perfectly law abiding decent americans and i like you have no desire to infringe on their rights to defend themselves at home or hunt. that's not what this is about. that being said, 100,000 new members have joined the nra since sandy hook. we have also seen record sales in november since sandy hook of ar-15 weapons and of ammunition, and i look at that kind of statistic and i despair.

>> it's not a good situation. more assault rifles on the street, probably more high-capacity magazines. those issues needed to be addressed. also, i mean, you know, one thing we need to seriously look at is a universal background check. it's very easy in this country for a criminal or someone who is mentally ill to get a weapon. and for the mentally -- the segment of our society that has some form of mental illness, we need to figure out how to identify them and get them some kind of treatment because a lot of these incidents if we do those things, common sense things, we're not going to stop every one of them, but we can stop some of them. >> a terrific job, mark, in keeping this right up there on the agenda. i congratulate the new initiative with gabby. there's a real financial and political power to the gun rights lobby which has to be at least challenged and competed with. i think you're well on the way

to doing that. i applaud you for doing that. >> thank you, piers. americans for responsible solutions is going to folks on coming up with common sense solutions, trying to get members congress to pass gun legislation. we plan to educate the constituents and work with members on both sides of the aisle, like gabby did when she was in congress, to do something about this issue. >> send my best to gabby, and mark, thank you for your time. it's been a fascinating interview because you are exactly what the gun rights lobby don't want to hear from. you're a gun owner, you're a man who supports the second amendment, so is your wife who was shot in the head, and you don't want to take away those rights. that's why what you say is so powerful, and i thank you for joining me. >> you're welcome, piers, and glad you didn't get deported last week. >> thank you very much. i appreciate it. when we come back, a man who says i'm off the rails when it comes to guns.

and tony robbins has surprising things to say about the rising toll of gun violence in america.

there's nothing that has gone to the heart of the matter more than the visual image these people have of little 6-year-old kids riveted, not shot with a stray bullet, riveted, riddled with bullet holes in their classroom. and the public demands we speak to it. >> strong words from vice president biden who heads the white house task force on guns. my next guest has strong words for me, says i'm off the rails when it comes to guns. he's the author of "bullies." why am i off the rails? >> honestly, you have kind of been a bully on this issue. i watch your show, and i have seen it repeatedly. what you tend to do is demonize people who differ from your politically by standing on the graves of the children of sandy hook, that they don't care enough about the dead kids.

i think we can have a rational political conversation about balancing rights and risks and rewards of all of these different policies, but i don't think what we need to do is demonize people on the other side about being unfeeling. >> how dare you accuse me of standing on the graves of children who died there. how dare you? >> i have seen you do it repeatedly. >> like i say, how dare you? >> i have seen you do it repeatedly. you keep saying to folks if they disagree with you politically, somehow this is a violation of what happened in sandy hook. i really like to hear your policy prescription for what we should do about guns. because you say you're respectful of the second amendment. i brought this for you, you can read it, the constitution. i would like for you to explain to me what you would do about guns to prevent sandy hook. if you want to do what they did in the uk, that's a fair argument and we can have a discussion. >> i made it clear what i want

to do which is what mark kelly wants to do. >> let's talk about that. >> rather than address your comment to me about standing on the graves of children at sandy hook, you can address them to mark kelly because he agrees with everything i have been saying as he feels the same way, as does his wife and they're both gun owners. they respect the second amendment of the constitution, they dont want to take away anyone's right to defend themselves with guns. >> they want to take away certain guns. >> assault weapons that we saw in aurora and sandy hook, of unleashing a ridiculous -- >> this is what i wanted to ask you because i have seen you talk about assault weapons a lot, and i have seen mark kelly talk about assault weapons. the vast majority of murders in this country are not committed with handguns, not assault weapons. why don't you care about banning the handguns in chicago? >> let me ask you this. what was the weapon used in

aurora in the movie theater? >> it was an assault rifle, sure. >> what was the weapon used in the oregon shopping mall? >> an assault weapon. >> sandy hook? >> an assault rifle. >> the incident around christmas when the firemen were lured to their deaths. >> and bought illegally? that was an assault rifle. >> that's is the reason, mr. shapiro. you can smirk at me and you can laugh at me. >> i'm not smirking. >> and you can accuse me of standing on the graves of dead children. >> and being a bully, yes. >> that's the reason that people like me and mark kelly and gabrielle giffords want to have assault weapons like that removed from civilian hands. >> your passion on the issue doesn't really justify the rationale for why you want to ban assault weapons. >> the preferred weapon of choice, these killing machines, from the hands of deranged young men. >> if what you're worried about

is the removal of killing machines, maybe we should talk about a blanket gun ban, and let's get to what the left really wants. >> why is it about left or right? in britain, it's not about left or right. why is it here? >> fundamentally, the right believes the basis for the second amendment, and they believe in the second amendment, the basis of the second amendment is not really about self defense and it's not about hunting. it's about resistance to government tyranny. >> which tyranny are you fearing? >> i fear the possibility of a tyranny rising in the country in the next 50 to 100 years. let me tell you something, the fact that my grandparents and great grandparents in europe didn't fear that is why they're now ashes in europe. this leftist revisionist history where there's no fear of democracy or tyrannical, is just that. >> just to clarify your position, the answer to sandy hook, as it was to aurora, as it was to gabrielle giffords, as it was to columbine and virginia tech is you do nothing. is that your position? >> that's not my position. my position is we have to

calibrate laws that are designed to get guns out of the hands of bad people and keep guns in the hands of good people who want to buy them. >> how do you do that? >> one of the ways you do that is better screening for mental illness. better background checks. >> was adam lanza's mother a good person? >> i don't know. she was irresponsible with her gun. >> was there any evidence to suggest she was not a good person? >> no, but -- >> your criteria. wait a minute, by your criteria of the good people should be allowed to guns and the bad people shouldn't, she would have been allowed a gun. >> she was an irresponsible person. she didn't keep her gun locked up. that should be against the law. if you have a mentally ill person in your house -- we're talking about laws we can agree on. >> then she becomes a bad person, isn't she? is she good or bad? >> i should have said responsible versus irresponsible. >> she goes from good to bad? >> she goes from responsible to irresponsible. >> let's take a break and talk more when we come back because we don't agree.

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i'm with ben shapiro. author of "bullies." do you believe if you had an assault weapon ban, statistics prove you could dry out the supply of these guns and make them less accessible to criminals? >> i don't know whether you could make them less accessible to criminals. let's assume that's the case. again, my question still remains for you. and i'm still waiting for an answer from the left, if you want to solve if weapon problem, why not ban all guns? >> i believe in americans'

rights under the constitution to defend themselves with a handgun or a pistol. >> and most murders are committed with those weapons. adam lanza had two pistols on him. >> he didn't use them. >> if he didn't have the assault rifle, he wouldn't have used them? >> i can't buy this. this is six packets of sudafed, which you can't buy legally in america. that is illegal for me to buy in that quantity in walmart, say, but i can buy an ar-15 military style assault rifle. i can then, as we saw with holmes, the shooter in aurora, get 6,000 rounds of ammunition from the internet and shoot up an movie theater. >> what would make sense is laws calibrated to solve the problem.

if you think the problem is only assault rifles -- >> which guns would you remove? >> fully automatic weapons would be a good start. i think -- >> you wouldn't remove any semiautomatic? >> no, because it means when you pull the trigger once, one bullet comes out. >> you understand how an ar-15 performs when it's been modified? >> i do. it was illegal to do that, and people did it anyway. we have 12 million illegal immigrants in this country. we're not able to stop people from coming illegally into the country into places like southern california, where i live normally. you could be hard pressed to stop guns from coming across the border illegally as well. california has some of the strictest laws in the nation. >> would you want every american to have an ar-15? >> not every american. >> who would you stop? >> anyone with a criminal background, with a mental illness, and i would ask if they have anyone in the household with a criminal history or mental illness to keep the gun locked up. >> what about background checks?

>> i believe in background checks. >> for everybody? >> for everybody. >> there shouldn't be a database? >> if it's public. >> when the nra came out today after the meeting in the white house and said it's not prepared to affect any new gun restrictions, what did you think about that? >> what is astonishing to me is the attack on the nra. they like to talk about violent video games, for example. >> framing intellectual right, i vote either way. >> you tend to be more to the left. >> the nra, as you know, are very active and well funded and powerful body. >> i want to finish a point. very quick, i promise. the point i'm making is this. there's been a lot of talk by a lot of people about video game violence. i haven't seen david gregory interviewing the head of the

aclu and saying it's your broad interpretation of the first amendment that is responsible for this. but people are bringing on the nra and saying it's your broad interpretation of the second amendment. if you want legislation passed, go to the legislator. >> here is what the nra and people like alex jones and others do -- >> don't link me in with alex jones. >> okay, after the massacres, the gun rights supporters come out and they basically instill fear. they say if everyone -- >> they instill fear? >> if everyone in the movie theater had been armed, everyone in the school had been armed, it wouldn't have happened. here is what happens. gun sales and ammunition sales rocket. >> don't pass the buck, piers. >> the reason people are buying a lot of guns is because people on the left are talking very much about banning guns. a lot of people are saying if i am not going to have the right to purchase a weapon of my choosing in two months, i'm going to buy it now. >> why did ronald reagan want them banned? >> i don't know.

>> did you agree with him on assault weapons? >> i'll agree with what you say, sure. i don't know what his position on assault weapons was. why don't you tell me? >> let me read you a letter he penned to congress. >> okay, that's ronald reagan. >> you creep framing it as right and left. one of the great presidents of modern times agreed with me. it's not left or right is it? >> okay, piers -- >> and the way the nra was in the '80s and '90s and have tried

to frame this as a left-wing attack on the american constitution and the second amendment, you come in, you brandish your book. >> that's the constitution. >> i know what its your constitution. >> do you really? >> i have been debating it for a long time. >> you should read the second amendment again. >> what i haven't heard is one coherent explanation for why an american needs an assault weapon. >> i told you. >> why do they need those weapons? >> for the possible to the resistance of tyranny. >> where do you expect it to come from? >> from the united states. >> do you know how absurd you sound? >> here's where you go into the bullying. >> i'm not the one who came in here and accused you of standing on the graves of dead children. >> because you're the one who is doing that. you know what i call it?

punching back twice as hard. >> that's what i call bullying. >> astonishing. >> what is astonishing? >> for weeks you have been saying that anybody who disagrees with your position is absurd, idiotic, and doesn't care about the kids in sandy hook. then when i say it's a bullying tactic, you say i'm bullying you. >> let me ask you again, what is the point of a civilian having an ar-15? >> many of them are ex-military. i don't have a problem with colin powell owning an ar-15. >> what does it depend on? >> the civilian. >> forget if criminals are mentally ill, an average civilian, why do they need one? >> to protect against the possibility of eventual government tyranny. this was the purpose of the second amendment originally. it remains the purpose of the second amendment now, and pretending that governments have never -- >> you believe your own government is going to turn on

you on a way that you require an ar-15 to challenge them? you really believe that will happen? in modern day america, is that what you think? >> they may not turn on me or my children, but history is replete with democracies going tyrannical. it happened in france in the 19th century, in spain in the last century, happened in germany, in italy. in japan. >> the reason we cannot remove ar-15 assault weapons is the threat of your own government turning on you? >> it's the right and responsibility -- i don't understand why you can't -- why can't we agree about reasonable law? >> you have made your point crystal clear. people aren't stupid. they can make up their own minds. ben shapiro, thank you. coming up, my exclusive with an amazing young man who survived a school shooting and now wants to help the people of newtown. he tells his story, next.

breaking news tonight on the aurora movie theater massacre. a court rules the prosecution proved their case. that means holmes will go to trial for the shooting rampage that killed 12 people and wounded nearly 60 others. he's held without bail and expected to be formally arraigned tomorrow. a survivor of another shooting last year joins me exclusively, one of the students injured. welcome to you. you were left paralyzed, shot four times. you're in a wheelchair now. you're 18 years old now. what are your feelings about this debate? you have heard a lot of the arguments. >> i am just an 18-year-old kid. i realize that, but i have an opinion, and what i'm going to say is something needs to be done. kids go to school.

they don't choose to go to school, and they're not protected in school. i mean, i obviously was not. and this is because of -- we need stricter gun laws. really. >> when you hear like my last guest, somebody so intransigent who says look, this is the constitution of the united states and it entitles us to have these weapons. >> the second amendment, you know, the second amendment is -- i fully support it. but fully automatic weapons, like you said, are unneeded. >> or semiautomatic. when they're modified, they behave like an automatic, like a machine gun. although it wasn't used in your particular instance, the reality is if they're used in a movie theater or an elementary school, they cause complete carnage. and that is the argument.

>> whether it's fully automatic or semiautomatic, my opinion is something needs to happen. really does. >> your heart must have gone out to the families involved in sandy hook. your life has been turned upside down by what happened to you. what advice can you give them? >> hang in there. i mean, i -- i have a friend named danny. he didn't get shot, but he's a survivor because he has the mental picture of being there, and it's just -- it's really sad because he's such a good kid. he just hangs in there. you have to -- you got to just

break away from what happened and just try to get some help, do whatever you can. >> you have a friend who i think was a diver who also was left paralyzed by an accident diving, and you drew great strength from that, i know. is that important to find other people? have you thought about going up to sandy hook? >> i would love to go to sandy hook. whether it's me being paralyzed or me finding other people who were in a school shooting, it helped me a lot just to heal mentally. good therapy. probably the best therapy i have had is having other people that went through the same thing i have, whether it's a spinal cord injury or a school shooting. >> i have seen a lot of people on twitter and facebook, and this is a fiery debate with lots of emotion on both sides, i have seen a lot of young people saying enough is enough and

something has to be done. i have a feeling the younger generation is not as entrenched in the views that everyone should have any gun they want. what do your friends and people you know think in your age group? >> they feel that something does need to be done, but what? what can we do? in our case, it wasn't a semiautomatic or a fully automatic. it was semiautomatic, i'm sorry, but what can be done? we do have a cop in our high school now. that's there all day. but what else can be done? you know, something has to be done with the guns that already have been purchased. i feel there needs to be stronger background checks. even family needs to be checked before purchasing a weapon of

any type. >> you have to know who has the guns. that should be the first protocol. and there are too many guns to remove them all, obviously, but it's unsettling that i can't buy six packets of pain killers, but i can buy an ar-15 at walmart. i don't think that's ever going to help society. >> i also feel that guns need to be more locked up. locked up at all times. because most of -- what i feel is most of the shootings that happen is guns that have been taken. it's not guns that were legally bought. or they were legally bought but they were taken. they need to be locked up. >> nick, you're an inspiration. it's amazing you have got the confidence you have now and the positivity you have about your future life. it's a harrowing thing you have been through and i appreciate you coming in.

>> thank you very much. coming up, a man who has helped millions of people in the country. tony robbins on how americans can get through these stressful times.

my next guest has some things to go about the toll of gun violence in this country. joining me now, tony robbins. tony, such a polarizing issue. i do try to respect the views of people i don't agree with about this, but i find the way they deliver them sometimes very insensitive. what is your view of guns, generally? >> well, i think the first issue, for me, is what's really happening? what's really happening in our culture, and i think what's beautiful is as painful as this

is, human beings can change one of two ways, there's an opportunity, or they do it because they are at a threshold. america is at a threshold. the stacking of these brutal events is where gun owners are saying something has to be done. that's creating an environment where real change can occur. what's important is for us to look at each other, no matter what side. i have friends on both sides of this issue, and it's the ability for us to get them to see, hey, listen, everybody has pure intent. we all have to want the exact same thing. that young man on earlier, gabby, mark, yourself, myself, we want to make sure our kids are safe, our family, husbands, wives, mothers, fathers are safe, we want to make sure people are respected. we have forgotten that. if you put your fist out and i push on you, what happens? 99% of people are going to push back. i think the most important thing right now is for us to enter the

other person's world and say i know their intent is pure. we have one difference, how to do it, and what's encouraging is the vice president today saying, look, we're truly going to sit down and hear from every faction and look at what the solutions are. if we demonize, we'll be having the discussion ten years from now. we've got to step out of it. >> the guest, mr. shapiro tonight, the problem is if you try to talk about gun control with those who don't believe about it, they don't want to give up any weapons and try to frame it as you want to take all our guns and infringe my constitutional rights, that's not what i want to do or mark kelly, joe biden, barack obama, not what anybody sensible wants to do, but that's the way, when you talk about the demonizing, the argument gets framed. and it makes you look like you're being unpatriotic if you dare to question it. >> yes. there's a martial art, most are about breaking the other person.

what's beautiful about the art of hakito is someone's attack on you becomes an energy that you welcome. instead of trying to hurt them, you align with them and redirect them. it's actually a beautiful art. that's what we're not doing on the economy, guns, we become more polarized. there is a solution. you took a lot more in, you took umbrance to the idea you're stepping on graves, which anyone would, but it was different when you're saying you're wrong. i've done the same thing. >> listen, i'm trying to be fair minded and listen to the debate. what i find hard is when i'm categorized as being some raging lefty who hates the constitution. i totally respect and admire the constitution and the second amendment and the americans' right to defend themselves at home. what i hadn't heard yet, and he couldn't give me one, is a coherent argument why any civilian actually needs one of these assault weapons. you got to make a stand

somewhere and you have to start somewhere. the logical place to start, given the automatic weapons are banned, is you go to the next level down, semi-automatic weapons. in an ideal world, i'd have all guns gone, as we have in britain, but this is not my country and i respect the fact most americans wouldn't wear that kind of argument. that's why i feel angry when i'm being categorized in a way i think is wrong. >> but i agree with you, and i thought it was unfair what he said. i'm not saying that to blow smoke in your direction, but when we're passionate, both sides tend to do this, and what we have to be able to do is create space to say where are we aligned, we agree on protecting our kids, we agree on respect. what are some ways we can do that? we may differ on the decisions, but we don't have to make the person wrong. i can disagree without making you wrong. i think there's another issue, though, that i haven't heard talked about. we're not going to eliminate guns in this country, there's

300 million of them, regardless of your point of view. people are still not noticing who's creating this havoc, the who. i don't mean just mentally ill. it's young males. how many young females have done this? >> almost all the recent massacres have been young males. >> there's a reason. young males get filled with testosterone at a young age and no one has taught them, all cultures, piers, have had a transition from being a child to being an adult and that is about how to use power responsibly so you protect and care. the military, for hundreds of years, has shown people how to use these and not be abusive with them. >> i think there's lots of different components here, video games, hollywood violent movies, mental health, parental responsibilities, but in the end, they are the catalyst of the killings is the gun. tony, good to see you. >> thanks for having me. >> we have a big one-hour special coming up, looking forward to that very much. we'll be right back.